Posted by Roberta Grimes • April 03, 2021 • 46 Comments
Book News, Jesus, The Source
Christ the Lord is risen today, Alleluia!
Earth and heaven in chorus say, Alleluia!
Raise your joys and triumphs high, Alleluia!
Sing, ye heavens, and earth reply, Alleluia!
– Charles Wesley (1707-1788), from “Christ the Lord Is Risen Today” (1739)
At Easter we celebrate the most important set of events in human history. Insofar as we know, nothing else like it ever has happened, either before or since; and the significance of those events could not have been understood by anyone who witnessed them. Indeed, it is likely that even today we don’t yet know what it all really means! And the fact that a couple of centuries later a new religion created its own dogmas around that extraordinary set of events doesn’t make what happened any less the wondrous possession of ALL of humankind.
Two thousand years ago an element of the highest aspect of the Godhead was born in a human body as God on earth, both to study humanity and to teach us how to achieve the next stage of our spiritual development. To prove to iron-age primitives that death is an illusion, God in human form then allowed Himself to be publicly murdered so His body could lie in a tomb for two days before He re-animated it and rose from the dead. What an amazing story! And now we know that the miraculous events of that extraordinary life were indisputably REAL!
The fact that God chose to be naturally born and to live an entirely human life and death is important. We assume that God knows everything, but in fact my dear spirit guide, Thomas, has told me that once the more spiritually perfected members of the single consciousness that humanity shares cease to incarnate, they pretty quickly lose touch with what it’s like to be a human being. He tells me that Jesus came to us from the highest aspect of the Godhead in part so God could “look through His eyes” and better understand why we were finding it so hard to do what our earth-life is designed to do, which is to help us grow rapidly away from fear and hatred and toward ever more perfect love.
Last Easter we talked about the fact that based upon very extensive modern studies of the Shroud of Turin, the Resurrection of Jesus can be treated as an evidence-based historical event. And in fact, there also is a lot of evidence that Jesus really did live on earth. Astonishingly, there even is evidence that His death in 33 AD was brought about in part by a financial panic (of all things!). And we know now based on evidence that the Gospels are real historical documents, even if they were somewhat altered by later Christian councils. We are fortunate that an army of Christian researchers has been working for more than a century, seeking every possible confirmation that Jesus is a proven historical figure and the miraculous events of His life were real.
Anglican scholar and bishop N. T. Wright is one of those seeking to prove the reality of Jesus and His miracles. He has written a facts-dense and lengthy book called The Resurrection of the Son of God, where he makes a number of evidence-based claims. He specifically notes that the eyewitness accounts contain details large and small that strongly suggest that these were real events. For example:
* The idea of a murdered corpse dead for days suddenly reanimating on its own is found in no other religious tradition. Such an event is miraculous, true, but it’s also ghoulish and off-putting.
* The Gospel Resurrection accounts feel grounded in plausible facts. For example, the mentions of the discarded shroud and the face-cloth lying separately folded seem like genuine details that an eyewitness would have noticed and mentioned.
* Jesus’s body had been damaged by its death, decay, and subsequent reanimation. And damaged in ways that Iron Age people creating a story from whole cloth are unlikely to have considered or known how to describe. People who had been in frequent contact with Jesus didn’t even recognize Him at first, which suggests that two days of decay had altered the body’s appearance and perhaps had interfered with His ability to fully re-animate it. Interestingly, Jesus also seems to have considered His risen body to be so fragile that He asked that Mary not touch it. These are such gritty eyewitness details that even you or I would have been unlikely to have thought of them.
The execution of Jesus was an unexpected disaster for His followers. They had come to believe He was the Messiah, the Son of God, perhaps God on earth. They were so demoralized by the Lord’s death that they hurried to huddle behind closed doors, bereft now of all the excitement and hope that Jesus had inspired in them. He had just been executed as a criminal! And now perhaps they also were criminals? For me, the way so many of them were immediately and altogether transformed by His Resurrection may be the most important evidence of all that Jesus did rise from the dead. Once they saw and talked with the risen Lord, His disciples were infused with implacable zeal! They went from cowering in despair to fearlessly proclaiming what they had witnessed to all who would listen to them, and many of them were eventually martyred. These people were the source of all those Easter stories. And nothing can explain their sudden transformation beyond a certainty that they had witnessed an event so miraculous that it was worth all their lives.
There are other scholars, too, whose work provides further powerful evidence that the Resurrection was real. For example, Timothy Keller is a noted theologian. His brand-new book on the Resurrection of Jesus is called Hope in Times of Fear: The Resurrection and the meaning of Easter. One of Pastor Keller’s many insights is that when English translations of the Bible talk about “hope,” the word doesn’t do justice to the Greek word used in the New Testament, which is elpida. Keller tells us that a more precise translation would be “profound certainty.” This may seem like a little thing, but the New Testament contains many references to “hope in the Resurrection of the dead” and “hope in God.” If we read these passages as “profound certainty” in God and in the Resurrection, they are very different and much more positive claims!
I have mostly dismissed the Apostle Paul as a naïve first-century fabulist who never even knew Jesus. And clearly, Paul never had access to anything like the Lord’s whole story! But Thomas has made me see that Paul was Jesus’s very useful servant. Paul organized and inspired His earliest followers as they preserved His earthly life and teachings, and some of what Paul wrote was actually channeled by Spirit. Now Timothy Keller has helped me see that some of the stories told in Paul’s letters are actual contemporaneous accounts! He says of Paul’s First Letter to the Corinthians, Chapter 15, Verses 3-7:
One of the oldest theories is that the legends of Jesus’s resurrection developed only many decades after the actual events had faded from living memory. But the 1 Corinthians text is itself an important piece of evidence against that view. Verses 3–7 are now seen by most New Testament scholars as not an original Pauline composition but rather an early gospel summary used by the earliest church in its evangelism and instruction which Paul is citing. As he says in verse 3, these words were “received,” not created by him, and then “passed on” to others. Scholars also show that the vocabulary in these verses — “according to the Scriptures,” “on the third day,” “the Twelve” are not terms Paul uses elsewhere in his writings. So this was a gospel summary that was already in widespread use by Christians all around the Mediterranean world when Paul wrote. Since this letter to the Corinthians was written only fifteen or twenty years after Jesus’s death, the eminent biblical scholar James Dunn concludes that “we can be entirely confident” that this summary in 1 Corinthians 15:3–7 “was formulated . . . within months of Jesus’s death” (with thanks to Father Richard Rohr).
So there you have it. Two thousand years ago an aspect of the Godhead was born on earth as a human being and lived as one of us for thirty years while He studied the people around Him and came to better understand them. Then for a few years He publicly taught His flock how to overcome this world’s extreme negativity and use it to better grow spiritually. And finally, to prove to primitive people that human beings don’t really die, God in human form allowed Himself to be publicly tortured, murdered, wrapped in a shroud, and laid in a tomb. Two days later He re-animated His dead body with an extraordinary burst of energy, and He showed Himself to His disciples. The entire life of Jesus is a set of divine miracles unique in human history!
But there is no good evidence that Jesus meant to start a new religion. In fact, there is considerable evidence that He came to end our long dependence on our man-made religious beliefs and teach us to relate to God directly and entirely on our own. Jesus is in fact both God on earth and an adamantly non-religious figure. His amazing life is a timeless gift to all of humankind! And now, at long last, it is time for us to listen to the historical Jesus, and to seek to understand and then willingly defer to the Godhead’s wishes about what should come next….
Soar we now where Christ has led, Alleluia!
Following our exalted Head, Alleluia!
Made like Him, like Him we rise, Alleluia!
Ours the cross, the grave, the skies, Alleluia!
– Charles Wesley (1707-1788), from “Christ the Lord is Risen Today” (1739)
Hi Roberta, hi everybody! Happy Easter!
Dear Mike, we were so immersed in family that I never even made it here on Sunday. I hope that you and your family and everyone here had a wonderful Easter holiday!
Happy Easter dearest Roberta and everyone in our blog family! May the joy of Jesus’ Resurrection light all our hearts as one.
Darling Efrem, thank you! I hope that you and yours had a wonderful holiday!
HE has truly risen.
Thank you Roberta for replying to my emails so quickly.
Oh my dear Richard, I do my best to respond quickly! But it is getting harder and harder to do it all. No time! But I don’t complain – that’s better than having too much time on my hands….
Easter Wings
BY GEORGE HERBERT
Lord, who createdst man in wealth and store,
Though foolishly he lost the same,
Decaying more and more,
Till he became
Most poore:
With thee
O let me rise
As larks, harmoniously,
And sing this day thy victories:
Then shall the fall further the flight in me.
My tender age in sorrow did beginne
And still with sicknesses and shame.
Thou didst so punish sinne,
That I became
Most thinne.
With thee
Let me combine,
And feel thy victorie:
For, if I imp my wing on thine,
Affliction shall advance the flight in me.
Dear Richard, Thank you for this! Do you know the story of this poem? When was it written? The language is charmingly archaic.
Hello. I think I see the shape of the map you are drawing for The Way. A very focused, energetic map. A simple map, but with much power. I have seen a similar map, but using Buddhist terms, and people have talked about transformations. I went to that group for a while, should be interesting to watch how The Way fills out the particulars of the map it is creating.
Happy Easter.
Oh dear Jason, I’m impressed that you see it, because I still really don’t! From the beginning, I have been stuck on the fact that Christianity as a religion was built on fear – you’re going to burn in hell forever unless you get that get-out-of-hell-free card from Jesus, and He gives it only to Christians in good standing who jump through all the hoops, show up, take communion, tithe. That core Christian fear is so powerful! I see it in so many people who email me with fear-based questions (“But there has to be SOME punishment! Otherwise, why bother to be good? “); and I see it in my treasured husband of almost fifty years, who still tries to have us eating fish on Fridays and won’t miss (now online) Sunday Mass. That fear works beautifully to get people to get out of bed for church and put something in the till! And without enough people who feel compelled on some level to attend and to give, how do you keep ANYTHING together?
Figuring that out is going to be the hardest part….
Hello. Maybe seeing something from the outside is helpful. The Way seems less about fear and more about value creation, an inner transformation. Realizing that all beings have courage, wisdom and compassion. I recently watched a documentary about a woman who had an inner transformation, who finally felt empowered to leave her husband, who for years had been physically and sexually abusing her. Let the message be about liberation, freedom, the “Good News” of The Way. I think you would find people willing to come together without the need for fear.
Blessed Resurrection Day everyone. May the Son shine in your heart.
Dear AC, thank you! What a beautiful message! “May the Son shine in your heart.” Beautiful! I love it!
Dear Roberta,
There is a fundamental reason that humanity does not reliably honor the Ten Commandments and Golden Rule. The mortal body is designed for survival just as are all animal bodies. The brain is also designed to pursue pleasure and avoid pain. Furthermore, these brain functions operate with autonomy from the soul. I have documented three cases of Out of Body Experience in which the soul that left the body observed the body continuing to act on its own after they stopped controlling it (I have a paper in press about this autonomous behavior).
Freudian Personality Theory had distinguished three main functions. The Id seeks to avoid pain and death, but also to gain pleasure. The Ego works to constrain behavior that is dangerous,to gain pleasure, and also attends to the Super Ego guidance to be moral. Freud, in his effort to be scientific, had excluded God and soul as unscientific concepts. However, while anatomical brain research has in fact identified regions of the brain corresponding the Id and Ego– no evidence of Super Ego brain function has been found– and that’s because it is the soul attached to the body and is not directly observable as a material entity.
Our soul develops here as it works to master the amoral and immoral functioning of the human body in a stressful world, which as you say is a stress situation hard to recall and appreciate while in the bliss of Heaven.
Hello. Just to let you know, Roberta Grimes has her own definition of what the ego is, as described in “ The Extinction of the Ego” (December 15, 2018) I have been exploring Jung and some of the philosophers myself, love to look at different maps of reality.
Thank you, Jason! Most people are part of the materialist science nonsense, and thy use the Id-Ego-Superego model. But it’s just a way to describe functions – it’s not anything that is objectively real.
Roberta, Accurate to describe abstractions such as the personality constructs of Id, Ego, and Superego as function descriptions. However, in my paper in press I was able to relate Id and Ego functions to identified brain anatomy, making them “real.” Most significantly, just as the qualities of perception do not have an anatomical source in the brain, no location has been found for the Super Ego, such as by using fMRI to find the location. My hypothesis is that the Super Ego function is performed by the soul attached to the body, so it is not a material brain function.
Dear Jack, I do respect your efforts! And I understand that if you are working within the traditional mainstream scientific framework, then building on Freud is the way to go.
But in truth, mainstream scientific materialism gives to the material brain far too much importance. In reality, the brain is just what amounts to a radio with a data-processing function. A receiver and transmitter of consciousness that includes some hard-wiring. The problem for anyone trying to do science within the current system is the fact that science doesn’t want to acknowledge or have to care about anything that is not related to matter, and since we now know that not even matter is “material” in the sense of being solid, the scientific community has put itself far out on a fragile limb.
We are in fact eternal beings who spend a miniscule part of our eternity in this “material” reality, and nearly all of it in the greater reality which is not material at all. In our normal eternal lives, we have far vaster and more complex minds than what we can access with awareness while we are in bodies, and of course science doesn’t recognize any of that. To do science in the way that the gatekeepers presently allow – just by studying the bit of reality that we can access while we are in bodies – is a lot like trying to figure out how all that water made a big puddle on the floor by looking just at the floor and never considering the walls or the ceiling as sources (or even, indeed, acknowledging that the walls and the ceiling exist). Limiting the study of anything with a “fundamental dogma of materialism” really is not productive!
Dear Jack, thank you for this explanation! I haven’t much studied Freud, but in fact he uses some terms that also are used by researchers in my field, only he uses them differently. For example, to those who are open-mindedly researching the greater reality using evidence that doesn’t assume everything must be material, “mind” is consciousness, which is the core pre-existing creative force, and “ego” is attached to the body. Its core purpose is to keep the body alive and healthy, and in order for us to grow spiritually – which is essentially the elevation of our consciousness vibrations away from fear and toward ever more perfect love – we have to squash down and subjugate the ego. It really isn’t us! Nor does it have anything to do with who or what we actually are. It dies with the body. And I am coming to see now that once we have grown up successfully, we really don’t need it at all.
Perhaps it might be helpful to do a compare sometime with more traditional psychology? But on the other hand, what the Freudians and others are doing doesn’t seem to be of much value to us, since matter isn’t even real in any basic way. Or what do you think?
As you say, Freud ignores altogether the notion that consciousness is primary and is the source of everything we think of as real, as do all mainstream scientists, even today! And this, despite the fact that Max Planck – who is a big shot to scientists! – worked this all out a century ago. Which makes mainstream science the weirdest religion of all, since it is based on its own false dogma (the core belief that everything real is also physical or is generated by what is physical).
The place where anyone starts any form of research is going to largely dictate where you’ll end up, and when you start with the assumption that everything is either material or produced by something material, you end up in a set of conclusions that may or may not fit anything that exists in our true reality, which is not based in matter at all but is instead altogether based in the non-material energy that we experience as consciousness.
The paradigms are going to shift altogether within the next few decades. You can see it beginning. This really is a weird time to be alive!
This is interesting and makes a lot of sense. However, what do you think is happening with those who are totally amoral? Are they lacking a super ego or soul? Or is there some other explanation?
Lola, That’s the perfect question to ask. Based on this revised Freudian theory, the straight forward answer is that the soul is conceding its authority to the body for motivation and decision making.
The next question is what is the consequence for such weakness? The prominent answer, based on reincarnation research affirming it is real, is that at least one more life here is then likely to try again.
Dear Jack, a lot of what Freud said was nonsense, largely based upon his accepting the prevailing and perfectly absurd scientific theory of materialism. In simple fact, the body has no ability to be motivated or to make decisions. Yes, the mind of an incarnate being can feel unable to make decisions in some confounding situation, but the refusal to make a decision still is a form of decision-making. And it can cause no end of difficulties in our lives.
Dear Lola, at the root of all behavior issues is the fact that in order for us to grow spiritually, we must have unfettered free will. And that means that we can make some short-term decisions that will get us into some very negative situations!
Why would the soul concede its authority to the body for motivation and decision making? Does some type of trauma in the person’s life cause this, or is it some type of birth defect?
Dear Lola, I have seen no evidence at all that a human body can go off and make its own decisions, ignoring the mind driving it. The body’s nervous system possesses neither the capacity nor the will to do that.
Today we did a perfectly wonderful Seek Reality interview with the genius Dutch scientist Bernardo Kastrup that is going to air in just under three weeks. We talked there about various theories of Mind. You’ll love it!!
Yes, Freud is now outdated, and his views were very narrow. I’m looking forward to hearing Bernardo Kastrup – I only heard him once and found him fascinating. So glad you invited him on your show.
Dear Lola, there are four previous interviews with Bernardo in the Seek Reality archive that you can access right now. As I recall, every one of his interviews has been brilliant!
Lola, Simply because the Id and Ego are powerful for maintaining survival and seeking pleasure– it’s a real contest for all but advanced souls.
Dear Jack, I assume this is more of Freud’s theories? In practical fact, the ego can be subjugated, at which point the mind can raise its spiritual vibration fairly rapidly. I’m not sure what the “Id” is, so I have just done a quick Google. Here is the result:
“According to Freud psychoanalytic theory, the id is the primitive and instinctual part of the mind that contains sexual and aggressive drives and hidden memories, the super-ego operates as a moral conscience, and the ego is the realistic part that mediates between the desires of the id and the super-ego.”
This really has no relationship with what we are learning about spiritual growth, and I think in fact that it isn’t based in fact. I’ll ask Thomas to look into it….
Some will disagree with my assessment, but it seems to be true that today many psychologists, even psychotherapists, do not hold with Freud. Also important to remember that even those who do regard it as a model for treatment, not a description of how things operate. What do I know? I am an English major. To me, everything we experience is a metaphor.
Ha! Love it! “Everything that we experience is a metaphor” is such a profound insight!
Those who are not now in bodies and therefore have full use of their vast, eternal minds have told us repeatedly that the very limited aspects of our minds which are all that we can usefully access while we are in bodies are simply incapable of understanding a lot of things. They suggest that we shouldn’t even try to figure it all out until after we have left this illusion and gone home. Which is easy for them to say!
Hi Roberta, this is my beloved guide’s main theme for me, and the reason she won’t go near reincarnation, mediumship, etc., with me. Only developing the mystical relationship between this experience and the divine—because this is the current mission.
Roberta here:
Dear Mike, you make a wonderful point and I want to make sure that others see it. All our guides have us on different missions! My own mission is to teach the truth to people who have outgrown their religions, and to do it in ways that will make them more comfortable and help them to draw closer to the Lord. The limits on what I am supposed to learn and teach are clearest when I am sent new suggestions for people to interview on Seek Reality: I know immediately whether Thomas feels that some proposed guest or other is acceptable to him. So you are being given similar limitations by Arrow, based upon your own work to come! Everyone, your own guides probably are directing you, too, so please try to pay attention to their inner guidance. Thank you, Mike!
Oh I see. I assume that advanced souls would not be in that predicament in the first place. Sorry to harp so much on this, but it is of great interest to me.
Dear Lola, Freud’s theories are heavily material-world-based, when in fact our minds spend nearly all of eternity without bodies and in the entirely love-based greater reality. Freud, of course, had no idea about any of that.
See my comment above. In particular the metaphor part.
Hear! Hear! Dear Mike, sometimes you make me giggle 🙂
Dear Roberta and Mike J-R, hi everyone. I also liked the part about metaphors. I,’m still working on mind major; by degrees.
This is true and unfortunately, these decisions often affect some totally innocent people.
My dear Lola, sometimes it frustrates me that my days are so taken up that I can generally only get here after a lot of conversation has happened without my being able to participate. I’m really sorry about that! But I’m not sure quite what you mean by this comment. Unless perhaps it’s the fact that a lot of what Freud postulated still affects the lives of many innocent people, and to their detriment? If so, then yes, that is true indeed!
yes, that is what I meant.
Quote from above:
“And now, at long last, it is time for us to listen to the historical Jesus…”
Hi Roberta, hi everybody! Happy Easter Wednesday. Actually, I don’t know if there technically is an “Easter Wednesday”(we could look it up); on the Catholic liturgical calendar, there is an Easter Monday, although I can’t remember exactly what its official significance is (again, we could look it up), but generally this is the week when the reality and meaning of what happened on Easter Sunday begins to sink in to the disciples in the Gospels. It is important to note that when the news of the resurrection hit most of them, it is said right in the text that they did not believe it. Thomas (the disciple, not Roberta’s guide 😉 ) wasn’t the only doubter.
I hope everyone will take a few minutes, if possible, to look up the passage from Paul’s letter and read it for themselves. Also read Roberta’s post this week again and again, even though it is not Easter Sunday. This is not an Easter blog post, despite it’s debut on Easter.
This is a message for all time. Let’s imagine, if we can (it’s difficult for all our 2000 years of what did happen) that the shroud was discovered somewhere after 2000 years of absolutely none of the Christianity as we know it today. No dogma, no churches, no Pope or archbishops, or ministers, no need for Protestant reformation because nothing happens in the course of those first 300 years to capture the attention of the emperor in the first place. Then–one day– some archaeologists come across the shroud. What an odd piece of antiquity. Who is this man? Let’s look into it.
The more they examine (not to prove what it isn’t, but to discover what it is because, remember, there is no huge Christian Church on the planet) the shroud, the more curious it becomes because, hey! this is a crucified man, and he was really tortured. This isn’t an ordinary crucifixion and also, why would a criminal be buried in a fine linen cloth, or buried at all, since we know the Romans just discarded the criminals’ bodies. What a curious piece of antiquity this is.
And we go from there….discovering for the first time that this shroud originates in the region of Jordan, and that once upon a time, a small-town itinerant teacher in the same region inspired a few people to blaspheme the Roman empire and the Jewish Temple Elite. Why on earth would any defenseless group of disciples for a small-town teacher risk so much? And…what’s this? a bunch of lost parchment detailing an account of a crucifixion that matches the image and details on this shroud? Why, this is the story of that teacher–He is the crucified man. This is an amazing find!
What’s this all about? That is what Easter Wednesday is all about. Our discovery of Jesus’ significance begins now.
Oh my dear Mike, what you say here is so profound! I am just reading this now, on the subsequent Sunday morning, after having spent the week struggling with what has been the most difficult post that we have yet made, and I find that the same thing has been on your mind too!
What if we were to start all over? What if we could freshly discover the Easter Miracle without all the baggage and the first-century dogmas that Christianity has attached to it over thousands of years?
What if…?
I mentioned a couple of weeks ago that the cloth is far more significant than people think. It was the type that only someone well to do would own. Good point you made about it being odd that a crucified “criminal” would even wind up being buried in any cloth let alone one that was of a high quality. They found remains of quite a few crucifixion victims and none were found with any kind of cloth.
Dear Lola, the Shroud of Turin is truly and on so many levels the most extraordinary artifact! It was the thing that in the end broke this cold researcher’s heart of stone. And what an embarrassing confession that is! After decades of studying all the amazingly consistent afterlife evidence, the extraordinary evidence for the greater reality, and more and more moments when something new would turn up that amazingly made everything else statistically even more certain, this skeptical researcher was still just a researcher. I was still in a controllable way doing research that felt like a treasure-hunt and was really, to be frank, a lot of fun. I could have done it forever!
But then, all in a moment and only a couple of years ago, I came across all the modern evidence that the Shroud actually IS the Shroud that wrapped an unquestionably risen Jesus. And like Doubting Thomas, I fell to my knees and cried, “My Lord and my God!”
That was when I started really doing this spiritual work. You want to know what happens after death? Sure. We’ve got that. Here it is. But then, look at what we now know about GOD! That became the point of everything I do. And Thomas now tells me it has always been the point; it just took me awhile to get there.
Hi Roberta. That quote you have from Timothy Keller regarding Paul’s passage in 1 Corinthians 13 kind of blew my mind – that he was just quoting what was already a very commonly known crucifixion and resurrection tradition at such an early date is not something I was aware of. Most people just wonder when the gospels were written – a fair amount later – and that’s it, so this really moves the goal posts. I’ve been looking into Paul a bit more recently, especially in a book entitled, “In Search of Paul” by John Domenic Crossan, and in light of the letters of Paul judged to be authentic, as opposed to the more questionable ones, not to mention the Lukan material in Acts, I’m starting to think I was a bit too hard on Paul in the past. He actually seems fairly progressive for his time, and at times, like in 1 Corinthians 15, quite inspired. He certainly did a huge amount to get the Way widely known and practiced.
Dear Scott, this new information about Paul moves the goalposts for me as well! I have always considered the fact that our dead experts insist that the modern Gospel translations are accurate in telling us what Jesus actually said and did must be a miracle. Elevated Beings must have been presiding as those translations were being done! But now, as is true of the Shroud, we are finding fresh and immediate evidence of the life of Jesus. Real eyewitness accounts! And we have this new evidence thanks to Paul. I still consider him to be a man of his time, and not – as Jesus was and is – a Man out of time and in fact divine – but I agree with you. I’ve got more respect for Paul now!